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[VIDEO] Concealed Carrier Stops Attack On Elderly Man In Kroger Parking Lot

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LITTLE ROCK, ARKANSAS — A 24-year-old man with a concealed firearm was walking out of a Kroger grocery store when he noticed a group of 7 people surrounding an elderly man, and at least on of them was attacking him.

That’s when the armed man, identified as Gene, decided to get involved by drawing his firearm.

With the gun drawn the attackers turned their attention.
“They kept yelling this isn’t your fight, you need to walk away you need to put the gun down,” Gene says.

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People in the area started taking out their cell phones and recording the incident. One woman was recounted by Gene as having called 911 to report a man with a gun. Helpful.

By the time police arrived to the scene, both the group of people and the elderly man had taken off. As it turns out, they were all related. Police say the man was an uncle being assaulted by his nephew.

When Gene was asked whether he would have done the same thing after knowing what happened, his reply was yes. “If you see a crime happening and you see someone getting injured and you the ability to stop you should,” he said.

The uncle was left with a bloody face, but declined to press charges against his nephew that was responsible for the assault.

It’s also important to note that this happened in a Kroger parking lot. You know. . .that chain that Mom’s Demand Action tried to strong-arm into turning their stores into “gun free zones”.

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Categories: CCW In Action, General, News, Video
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About Brandon Curtis | View all posts by Brandon Curtis

Brandon is the founder of Concealed Nation and is an avid firearm enthusiast, with a particular interest in responsible concealed carry. His EDC is a Glock 27 that holds Hornady…

Brandon is the founder of Concealed Nation and is an avid firearm enthusiast, with a particular interest in responsible concealed carry. His EDC is a Glock 27 that holds Hornady 165 gr FTX Critical Defense rounds, and rides comfortably in an Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 3.0 holster.

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  • Chrissums

    First thing I was taught in my CHL course. Don’t get involved if you aren’t sure what is going on. For example, if the old man started the fight, and then you kill someone on his behalf, thinking you are defending him. Or worse, you kill one of his family members, and when the court date comes, he isn’t so thankful for you killing his nephew. I carry to protect me and mine. Period.

    • Michael A. Loomis III

      I agree Chrissums. The best thing he could have done was to call 911 and be a good witness.

      • Phillip Coffey

        And if the old man had been killed? Could you live with knowing you could have prevented a death and didn’t? I couldn’t. He stopped the beating and everyone walked away. Evidence says he assessed the situation correctly and brought it to an end with no further injuries. All of us know hindsight is 20/20, but looking at what “could” happen and doing the right thing is always a 50/50 proposition. “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Sir Edmund Burke.

        • rob

          Phil anounce your presence from a safe distance and warn them you are calling the cops if the beating continues then pull your weapon. i am pretty sure no one is gonna kill anyone with witnesses by instantly pulling your weapon you don’t know the situation and you have just escalated the situation buy actually perceiving them continuing to attack after you warn them about the cops you are justified to pull you gun.

    • wagrn

      ” Don’t get involved if you aren’t sure what is going on.”
      I agree with this.

    • Rick1556

      As an instructor, I feel that I must respond here. Yes, I agree that you should use judgement in getting involved with disagreements and verbal confrontations. Care must also be taken in equally matched fist fights, as there may not be a threat of great bodily harm. However, when there is a real threat of death or great bodily harm to someone, you should get involved. In this case, the elderly man was out matched and defenseless in stopping the “Threat” this crowd presented. Most instructors will error on the safe side, not wanting to create wannabe cops and vigilantes. But, I have more faith in the common sense of my students. Make a difference when you need to do so.

      • Phillip Coffey

        TY Rick… I can hang on to my 2 cents worth as you have already paid our tab.

    • Rick Clines

      A wise man once said “Hindsight is 20/20”. It’s easy to say now, after we know the story, that this was a family dispute and they weren’t trying to badly injure or kill him. In the moment, with 7 guys surrounding an old man beating him, you don’t, but you don’t just walk by and do nothing if you have the power to stop it. He is bloody and they continue to beat him. Why would you not step in? Afraid you might kill one of them? If they are in the right and the old man is in the wrong, they will stop. If they are in the wrong and the old man is in the right, you may have just saved his life.

    • Promontorium

      He shouldn’t be killing anyone. The use of deadly force is only justified if there is a reasonable chance not using it would result in the attackers causing death or serious bodily harm. In that instance it doesn’t matter who started a fight, nobody should be killing anyone else. If for example Person A starts a fight with Person B, and Person A is a total jerk, 100% at fault, but Person B decides to kill Person A for it and won’t stop beating Person A, then Person B is no longer a victim, and might get justifiably shot if refusing to cease the assault.

  • Tonga Saurus

    Hats off to Gene…way to be!

  • wildman

    Way to do it-Amen

  • HarloweThrombey

    What kind of trashy family has physical fights amongst themselves? Pure trash….

    • dbwells

      Mine. Holidays are a blast

      • Greg

        LMAO, great answer!!!

    • Dave Herrington

      Far too many. I can definitely relate to what dbwells said.

    • wagrn

      No one in our family would beat up on an uncle, aunt, parent, etc….but I have a couple of brothers I’d like to punch right in the mouth.

      • War Hammer

        That’s just brotherly love.

    • Fedup Veteran

      Trash, pure and simple. Gene may have done the noble thing but if the SHTF, he is screwed! Especially since it was family, they would all have turned on him and testified against him, even the old goat! Not a good move if you ask me. IMHO!

      • Kyle Brown

        not saying he did the wrong thing, but the number one rule in my book for actually drawing your fire arm.. protect you and your own. If you intervene in a situation you take the risk of making a mistake. you could shoot the victim in a situation thinking they were the aggressor.

        same as if someone seeing this situation had drawn on the man with the gun… they would have made a potentially fatal error. and may have been killed or have killed an innocent man.

        I am not saying there is no place for being a good Samaritan, but be careful.

        • J. Wade Harrell

          Exactly.

        • Lars Skiipole

          Good call

        • ronigee dawg

          Amen, you do NOT LEAD with the gun … last resort.

    • J. Wade Harrell

      You must be pretty fortunate. Doesn’t mean a family is trashy it just means you have some stubborn hot headed people. It’s happened in mine and we are far from trash.

      • PawneeBill47

        I disagree, as old as you are and you still physically fight with relatives you ARE trashy.

        • ronigee dawg

          Yep … mr harrell did not say what his definition of “trash” was … but IF he was thinking about wealth … I have heard a great saying : money does not necessarily change you, but it sure as hell can REVEAL you! ;-)

          • PawneeBill47

            Related? Trashy is a life style, in this case genetic. YOU are the toilet paper roll who brought up money.

  • Ron Arnold

    lucky he wasnt arrested for brandishing a firearm , what he did was highly illegal

    • Glenn Griffith

      Actually from what I know of Arkansas law it is not illegal. I tend to think it wasn’t because if it were they would charge him. If you have a link to prove it was illegal please do share. This kind of thing is usually not illegal in states with CCW because it’s the purpose of CCW. It’s the waste of space pu$$y states where it’s illegal.

      • ronigee dawg

        WRAWNG! Now I do NOT know the laws in Ark, but in Texas I believe the CHL committed a felony … you CANNOT pull the gun and use it as a threat like this. He was NOT defending himself, and at best he could argue he felt the life of the OTHER guy was threatened but without a direct threat of deadly force (I doubt a fist fight qualifies), the CHL was the only guy threatening lethal force.

        SO, even in states where CHL IS legal, it does NOT give you LEO powers. Yes he could have gotten involved but without direct physical threat to himself, pulling the gun is a big problem.

        • Phillip Coffey

          Except he wasn’t in Texas.

          • ronigee dawg

            my point being the laws here in TX call what he did a felony … regardless of the legality, it was stupid. C’mon, Phillip … you REALLY want some untrained yahoos yanking their piece and jumping in the fray every time some buffoons are acting like idiots??? REALLY? How about if your happy ass was parked BEHIND the trailer park trash, would him yanking his 45 be a good idea then?

          • Sorian

            Brandishing a Firearm in the act of defending of another is not illegal. Texas Penal Code Title 2, Chapter 9, Subsection C, Section 9.33.

          • Greg

            And ronigee dawg….change your avatar picture dude, nobody here believes you’re a snarling attack dog…….unless it’s one of those little nuetered teacup chihuahuas. All yap, no bite.

          • Greg

            Or should I say, All bark no balls????

          • Greg

            Can you cite the exact law that he broke in Texas? Because you keep altering from saying that I think he broke the law, to I don’t actually know the law, to he absolutely broke the law…..seems like you’re just making shit up as you go for the sake of arguement……..

        • War Hammer

          See my reply to this nonsense above. You’re all hung up on “LEO powers.” If this were actually a guy trying to use LEO tactics, he would have tried to arrest these guys. But, everybody involved had already left the area. It was apparent that this guys verbal warnings were only inciting further comment.

          If you had taken a CHL course you would remember the live fire range portion of the training and realized that you were time tested to draw a holstered weapon and immediately fire at your target. The live fire exercise scenario was you had already determined that a viable threat existed, your field of fire was clear and you were prepared to discharge your weapon to neutralize the threat. This was all done prior drawing and firing. Once this guy drew, it should have been all over but the crying.

        • Greg

          You might want to move from Texas, to say…ummmm Illinois or Massachusetts or one of those other Liberal nansy pantsy states. Cause from what I’ve read so far you my friend are too much of a micro testicle pussy to be a real Texan….just my humble opinion.

          • ronigee dawg

            try again, puke. in texas, this guy goes to jail. got it, a*hole? cuz in Texas we are expected to show discretion and intelligence, not act like a flaming pussy waving a gun in people’s faces from 50 feet away when you don’t know what the f* is even going on. Got it, jerk?

            but I tell you what … why don’t you come on down to Texas and start waving around your gun and sticking your f* nose in people’s stuff and see what happens to you? yeah, that’s right … the REST of us would blow your f* brains out … or more likely we would take the gun out of your quivering little fingers and beat you over the head with it … we have VERY low tolerance for pushy lil a*holes that substitute a gun for balls.

    • wagrn

      That is exactly what I was taught in OK. Don’t pull your weapon unless you are absolutely sure you’re going to use it. You pull it out, you use it, Period. That is how sure we are expected to be concerning any given situation before we use our weapons.

      • Nina Hunt

        Don’t agree, absolutely use it? Why? He held it where it was until police showed up. Have to shoot?

        • ronigee dawg

          nope. while wagrn was incorrect (you can pull it for imminent threat but not necessarily shoot) … this person was NEVER under imminent threat according to the article, and at best he only thought somebody else might have been threatened. For instance, if he shoots the assailant, I can virtually guarantee that he is going to be prosecuted … with the argument being EVERY attempt should have been made to stop the confrontation WITHOUT deadly force. This guys FIRST option was threaten with lethal force.

          • wagrn

            Might be incorrect in Texas, Ronigee dawg, but not in OK.

            The states that allow concealed carry need to get together and develop laws that apply to everyone the same way in each of those states.

            A lot less confusion that way. OK will be the same as Texas, and Texas the same as AR and AR the same as LA….etc…etc…etc…

      • Jonathan Trivette

        If by “using it”, you mean firing it, then you were taught wrong. The best possible scenario is that the person threatening you or someone you are trying to protect backs down and leaves once you draw your weapon. You should let them know that you have the intent to use it if they continue doing what they were doing but you don’t have to fire the weapon just because you draw it but you do need to be mentally and physically prepared to fire it if necessary.

        • GunTotingFoolio

          You’re wrong… In CA they teach the opposite. You use deadly force when life is in danger. You draw your weapon to use it, which means BANG BANG, threat stopped…

          • wagrn

            Exactly the same thing in OK.

          • Jonathan Trivette

            Gun Toting Fool……your name says it all.

          • GunTotingFoolio

            Whats that mean? Moniker is exactly what it is… A MONIKER! You moron…. I have more training in lethal force then you will ever have! Sux to be you…..

      • Wibbins

        You use your carry to stop the threat, he didn’t have to shoot because the threat stopped

        • Phillip Coffey

          Precisely the point.

        • GunTotingFoolio

          There was no threat….. Family arguing….

        • wagrn

          YOu don’t pull your weapon unless you have no other choice to pull your weapon, then, after you pull your weapon, you use it. What this guy did is considered brandishing. He is not a law enforcement official, you see.

          Law enforcement officials can pull their weapons and not fire them, because they are law enforcement officials.

      • ronigee dawg

        NO! (btw … you might want to remove this article to prevent some perps’ lawyer using it against you! just sayin) … you have to show discretion at EVERY point … when you pull it, where you aim it (including background) … and when (God forbid) you pull that trigger. You make EVERY POSSIBLE ATTEMPT to avoid deploying that force.

        • War Hammer

          You need to stop making comments in this thread. You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about and your gonna get people killed by misinformation.

          • ronigee dawg

            Yeah, cuz YOU are the f*n expert, huh? Try pulling up the training materials on CHL, dipstick … and see what they say about this … that would be EXPERTS with 1000s of hours of experience both in training and analysis of CHL experiences. In the Texas CHL … they literally have a video of a REAL LIFE SITUATION where a girl is being thrown in a van in the parking lot of a grocery store … and they ask what the CHLs should do. Yes dumbass, the TRAINING tells you not to do what this idiot did. So if you don’t know what the f you are talking about, maybe YOU should shut up before somebody gets killed, because THE EXPERTS THAT TRAIN CHL say that YOU are wrong.

            So what are you arguing, hammerhead … that everytime somebody pulls their gun they need to open fire? And you call other people morons? They should not discern the situation in the background … I suppose you are an expert marksman that can hit dead nuts on target at 50 some odd feet (rough estimate in this situation … from the photos)?

            the purpose of CHL is to permit people to PROTECT THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILIES from an immediate physical threat … NOT to put yahoos in a position to play peacekeeper or LEO.
            Go troll somebody else.

          • wagrn

            How about some reference material for our respective states so we can read and learn from you?

            No need to get upset because someone disagreed with you.

            I agree with your statement concerning the purpose of CHL. When to actually pull the weapon and the trigger is our sticking point. OK teaches differently; or at least they did.

            If things have changed I am not aware of it. Since I am the most important person in the world, you’d think they would check with me before they changed the laws governing CHL in my home state of OK.

        • wagrn

          Nope. Wont remove it because this is what I was taught in the class I took. Where do you read differently for OK? I need to read it for myself.

    • Jason Altenbaugh

      So what Ron is saying is that it’s “highly illegal”, to help someone who may have been in imminent danger of death?

      Couple slams of your skull against the concrete and it’s game over (the perps need not be armed), his life was in danger to anyone with common sense.

      • War Hammer

        I wouldn’t pay attention to ronigee dawg.

        • wagrn

          He’s pretty much a loud mouthed idiot, aka moron know nothing. He does spew with authority though.

      • ronigee dawg

        Yeah, and if he stuck a grenade up his ass it would have been a terrible mess as well … it was a nephew fighting with his uncle … nothing even close to what you said. mind you, the CHL was not even close enough to the scene to know what the hell was going on, WITH HIS GUN ALREADY DRAWN. So yes, AS SOON AS he saw an imminent threat to life (and PLEASE do not pull that crap out of your butt about how one punch could do it, yes we have all heard the manure and that is 1 in a million) … he might have been justified. He was NOT justified … HE was the only one threatening deadly force in this situation … and as it turns out there was not even a crime.

        One other thing … I have defused several situations by simply yelling at the instigators to stop it, and this tends to bring in others to rally to stop the immediate threat IN MOST CASES. I have also been in situations where I saw an attack and I had to take down the assailant … yes not everybody can do that, I get it … but there is nothing special here and I dare say even if I had a weapon I would have taken the NON lethal avenue first.

        • Brock Johnson

          seven on one elderly man man already bleeding I would consider that imminent danger. HE pulled his weapon and was able to neutralize the danger without firing a shot. The fact that it was family is all known afterwards you have to go with what you know of the situation. If it was your mom or sister or wife and it was seven men raping her you want me decide their is no imminent danger to her life and call 911 and wait 20 minutes or longer for the police to arrive?

        • CZ75BOhio

          Domestic violence involves family. Let’s say your neighbor is beating the hell out of the spouse. You would just keep on walking because only fists are involved? Would you draw your firearm to keep your neighbor from being pummeled if your words didn’t stop it?

          • ronigee dawg

            Are you illiterate or just so excited to make a response that you literally walked past the obvious. Second paragraph … “I have defused …” … so no, I am actually one of the rare people that jumps in the middle of stuff while people that come on websites and squawk about what everybody else should do stand back and don’t do diddly, or pull out guns from 50 feet away. No … I WOULD NOT COMMIT A FELONY AND ENDANGER EVERYBODY by pulling out my DEADLY WEAPON to get some husband to stop … I would remove him myself. ONLY if I was unable to do that would I resort to other means … GOT IT???

            In other words (go back and actually try reading what I wrote) … the gun would be the absolute LAST RESORT … not pulled out from a distance when the moron had NO CLUE what was going on. Now, with a wife beating … which has NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS SITUATION … I would have to show DOUBLE the self control and resist pulling my gun, because frankly I am EXTREMELY short on guys slapping around women, and I would be WAY TOO INCLINED to take the f*r’s head off.

            Now, I did not use terribly big words or difficult concepts … can you FINALLY figure out what I am actually saying? This was a TEXTBOOK case of what NOT to do … this moron should be chastised for obscenely poor judgement, not lauded as some kind of peacemaker. He was DAMN lucky the situation did not escalate, OTHER people should not assume the same luck will always save them.

    • Mark Reid

      Congratulations on your law degree.

      In the state of indiana you may draw your weapon. There is no law on the books addressing “brandishing”. Once you point your gun at someone that’s when things get real.

      I don’t believe Arkansas has a “brandishing” law either. Feel free to look it up. It’s only when you aim at someone it becomes “intimidation”.

      If he was defending someone however he was acting with someone’s interest and safety.

      • ronigee dawg

        he is NOT a cop … he is NOT trained in LEO processes and procedures. if I am in that parking lot I do NOT want some hot dog schmuck with an itchy trigger finger pulling his gun because of some family affair … PERIOD. Worse … if somebody in the crowd sees his weapon, particularly if the CHL presents it in a threatening manner, THAT person can legitimately respond with lethal force. f I am in the parking lot and that guy comes at me with a gun pointed at/near me, if I get the chance he is going to get popped … I would be justified because he presented a lethal threat to me, he was never presented with a lethal threat.

        • Phillip Coffey

          How do you know he wasn’t trained? Did it say that? He brought the beat down to an end and no one was injured further, also his “itchy trigger finger” was miraculously munificent and no one was shot.

          • ronigee dawg

            A trained person would NOT have pulled a gun. Phillip … when cops enter into situations with altercations, are they all pulling their guns? no … so c’mon, bud. like i pointed out elsewhere … YOU don’t want yahoos jumping into altercations flashing heavy iron … this was a damn family feud, for crying out loud. Now, I keep reading fools talking about how the old guy could have been killed … and he went home with the family before the cops even showed up … no charges, nothing. What amazes me about this story is that it is TEXTBOOK on what not to do (they literally presented a very similar situation FROM A SURVEILLANCE RECORDING during my CHL training) and people are arguing the CHL was right!?! We are not supposed to be pulling the gun and jumping into unknown situations, that is common sense and in TX it is law (yes, I know, it ain’t texas! ;-).

            Now, what should the guy have done? You approach them, get loud … if there are others willing you tell them to come with you … and you shout (letting these idiots know you are drawing all kinds of attention) to STOP IT. Yeah, I know how it sounds … and you know what … the vast majority of the time it is absolutely effective. Yes, I have done it, and yes I have been in other situations where I had to get physical / disable somebody … and yes I certainly understand that not everybody can do that … but I can tell you that almost every OTHER time once you make things very public, the idiots cease. You make it known that the beat down IS going to end. Even inbred idiots are hesitant to get involved with 3rd parties, particularly somebody they do not know … because THAT is a ticket straight to prison and even a reasonable risk of getting your ass whooped AND sent to prison is going to put most of these yahoos on their heals.

            Oh, and in the 3-4 minutes it would take for this to escalate AFTER your diversion … guess who shows up?

        • War Hammer

          Someone getting their ass kicked is not a family affair, dumbass, regardless whether it is by another family member. It’s assault. I suppose if Mike Tyson was punching someone in his family, you wouldn’t consider that lethal either. You’re a moron. BTW, if you wait for someone to point a gun at you in order to shoot, you’ve already been shot you just haven’t realized it yet.

          • ronigee dawg

            Big words, armchair hero/zero … have you ever had to stop an altercation? did you kill anybody? allright then … stfu. I absolutely have been in situations like this and I was the one to bring it to an end, the vast majority of the time by just telling them to cut the crap out, but in other cases I had to take down the bad guy … now I did not have a gun at that point, but I sure as hell would not be drawing down into a situation I had NO clue about.

            Seriously … you f*n people are going to be getting our 2nd Amendment rights yanked because people do NOT want a*holes like this pulling their guns every time they see something they don’t like.

          • War Hammer

            Don’t piss your pants, junior. I’ve done both so many times I can’t count. I’m fairly adept at solving these types of problems without use of force. But, when you have 7 on 1 the likelihood of either you or me walking up to a bunch of rednecks bent on a fight with a family member and trying to stop it by simply saying knock it off will only get either one of us beat up or killed by the 7 and the 1 getting the beating because they are family. I’ve been doing this for about 35 years and I’ve come out ahead every time. Mind your manners, boy, or don’t you have any? Getting under your skin? Hope so. It’s kind a like going up to prison inmates by yourself and getting in their face. It never works out well for the one.

        • Jason Altenbaugh

          I don’t recall a sign being held up above the guys head saying “don’t shoot, it’s only my family trying to kill me”.

          People YOU know are the ones most likely to kill you, not strangers.

          • ronigee dawg

            So whenever you see a family arguing over something, pull your piece? do you even stand back to think of how ridiculous that comment is before you hit “Post”? OK, try again : NO lethal threat, NO indication of a real crime … the CHL NEVER knew what was going on until afterwards … WHAT exactly was his criteria to assume he had to respond with the threat of deadly force? NOTHING. He had NO clue what was going on. Your anecdotal crap is irrelevant … I would not give a damn what the sign said if somebody was shooting at somebody else, or somebody was stabbing somebody else, or whatever … he had NOTHING to indicate that a response with a gun was necessary … NOTHING.

            Now, again … this story is TEXTBOOK why you do NOT pull your gun … it was a family squabble that got out of hand. How the hell are you missing that??? The uncle … the so called victim … did not press charges or whatever … in fact he bailed BEFORE THE COPS GOT THERE … they had to go find him to find out what the hell was going on. Got it?

  • War Hammer

    This man, Gene, was patient and intelligent enough to control the situation without having to shoot anyone. Kudos.

    • ronigee dawg

      WRONG … you do NOT pull that gun … that was TOTALLY inappropriate. He is NOT a peace officer, nor an official of ANY capacity. If he got involved and THEN the threat came at him, THEN he might have been justified … not before. NOBODY indicated that deadly force was involved at any point … a physical altercation does NOT automatically mean you can introduce deadly force (or that threat).

      In Texas with our laws, I believe this guy probably committed a felony act or at the very least he would be breaking the law with what he did.

      • Wibbins

        The guy was being beat since he had a bloody face, there were what 7 people around him and no one was stopping it. If your wife was being beat by someone i bet you would pull your carry as well, but according to you because YOU aren’t in direct danger you wouldnt.

        • ronigee dawg

          Do not be a fool … wife vs complete stranger … I am allowed to protect my family, NOT walk INTO a situation and threaten deadly force WHERE NO OTHER THREAT IS PRESENTED. Now, I have absolutely gotten myself into situations where I stopped physical altercations with complete strangers, and it included me using physical force (I’ll leave it at that) to disable the assailant. ANYBODY that knows anything about these situations knows that in public settings you are going to be able to stop most situations by simply presenting yourself … the LAST thing you should do is pull your weapon.

          • Promontorium

            Your premise is fundamentally flawed, deadly force existed already with 7 people attacking an old man. He stopped a deadly force situation, he didn’t create one.

            The situation as described, 7 on 1, and a continuous attack on an elderly man, most certainly sounds like potential death for the old man. “NO OTHER THREAT” is needed. 7 on 1, is PLENTY. The law doesn’t care about your wife more than this old man, so YOUR OPINION is irrelevant as to who can defend whom. YOU might not, but that’s you. He chose to, and with as much right as you would your own relative.

            Finally, if you think it’s the job of law enforcement to resolve all conflicts, including ones citizens are capable of doing themselves and saving lives doing it, why are you on this page? You might carry for your own selfish protection, but you clearly don’t believe in anyone else’s rights.

          • Everyone elses protection is up to them, if they want protection they should arm themselves. Why should I, because I carry, have to put my life at risk to save someone?. Not me, I use my weapon for personal protection, not to protect you. My life is not worth yours, or of some family trash fighting in a kroger parking lot.

          • War Hammer

            You don’t have to put your life at risk. You can completely disengage from any event. I thought that I was the only one here that isn’t hindered by feelings or emotions. Thanks for the company.

          • ben

            War Hammer that family can sue now and take away your right to carry a gun take money out of your bank and possibly even get you jail time by pulling a gun you escalated the situation so if you think a couple of months in prison and money out of you pocket and your freedom taken away is not putting you at risk then go ahead

          • ronigee dawg

            I don’t go that quite that far, but I certainly do not expect anybody else to. I am a 210 lb athlete, so even in a secluded situation I will get myself involved to make sure somebody is not subjected to violence. I would want somebody to help me if I was violently attacked (and disarmed ;0). Now, this is Kroger in the middle of the day … a good loud shout, rallying support, and making it known you demand that they stop will ALMOST always stop it. Yes, I have been there and done that … both in very public and not so public situations, and I have had to mix it up when “almost” went the wrong way: and I admit I would be winging it now that I have (ahem) alternatives.

            Regardless … the experts agree with you to the extent you do NOT introduce deadly (or threat) force until you are directly threatened.

          • Ben

            promontorium you absolutely and utterly wrong

            you have a duty to retreat, by you pulling that gun you are trusting that the guy getting jumped did not do anything and you are putting your life in his hands. If you fired and shot someone you would be convicted Take a conceal and carry class and ask the instructor about this situation guarantee he says the guy was in the wrong. He should have called the cops. Even stating you have a gun is labeled as escalating the situation and is grounds to get you convicted. Another reason why i believe people should take a class before they carry cause they have no idea about the laws of carrying a gun.

          • ronigee dawg

            You are reading WAY too much in, and in fact are ignoring the actual outcome of the situation … EXACTLY why I am right about this. It was NOT 7 on 1, it LOOKED like 7 on 1 … but it was nephew vs uncle (family squabble) … but GUN was brought in before CHL had ANY clue about that, right? RIGHT??? This is textbook … CHL had no clue, he pulled gun FIRST from WAY too far away to know what was really going on.

            More importantly, the CHL was NEVER CLOSE ENOUGH TO WHAT WAS GOING ON TO KNOW THAT HIS INTRODUCTION OF (THREAT) DEADLY FORCE WAS INDICATED.

            CHL is the one saying he thought uncle was getting roughed up. What if uncle was drunk out of his mind, and nephew was trying to take keys away? Again, from 50 feet away, would family taking keys from drunk uncle look like uncle was being roughed up??? Remember … Uncle took off before LEOs showed up … with a 9-11 call on man with gun in Kroger parking lot, I’m guessing cops are there in less than 5 minutes … so Uncle and famliy got the hell out REAL fast. No crime, no arrest, no battery … only man threatening family with gun from 50 feet away.

            Now, I broke my own rule about speculating … so I am done here … but the bottom line is people ARE OK to get involved to stop an altercation (and me personally SHOULD get involved, but I am 210 lb athletic male) … you are NOT OK to introduce the threat of deadly force.

      • War Hammer

        In Texas where I got my CHL, our instructor taught us to defend others as well as yourself. You don’t draw until you’re ready to shoot. I don’t know where you got your CHL. But if I had been that guy and felt that there was an imminent threat against another person, the assailant would be dead. This guy was being very generous. I’m going to step out on a limb a little here and guess that you never went to a CHL course in your life and that your legal expertise is guesswork. Law Enforcement Officers in Texas appreciate having properly trained CHL holders who carry because Police are outnumbered by people who illegally carry guns.

        • ronigee dawg

          And you would be in prison, such a terrible development ;0). In the end here … it was a family fight … no charges. Get it? I just cannot believe with the facts of this situation completely against you, you press the case. This was a family argument … there was NEVER a lethal threat until the gunslinger shows up. This is TEXTBOOK why you don’t present lethal force (threat) … a tribe of trailer park trash acting the fool and the CHL has NO F*N CLUE what is going on when he presents the lethal threat. Like I said … the CHL training (Frisco, TX) specifically included a video of a REAL LIFE SITUATION of a girl being wrestled into a van … and the punchline was CALL 9-11, be a witness, but DO NOT PULL OUT THAT GUN. You are NOT an LEO or peacekeeper. This is the training … given to us by EXPERTS in CHL … not liberal anti-gun twits … and you are wrong, pal. I have to get some work done, you want to continue the argument, go get the CHL training changed.

          • Sorian

            Hindsight in this case. At the time Gene (the CHL holder) was there, he saw several people crowding around a elderly man who was being beaten by at least one of the crowd. At the time, he didn’t know it was a “family argument”/domestic violence. The elderly man was bleeding from a face wound.

            I know that calling the police is the first move to be taken, but Gene probably felt that the situation could have escalated to all of the crowd attacking the man. That is when he intervened.

          • ronigee dawg

            Intervened is good, introducing threat of lethal force not. In fact, he did not “intervene” per se … he was at a great distance (look at photos) and already drawn before any interaction began. You made my point : “he didn’t know it was a family argument” … in fact, he was too far away to make ANY assessment of the situation : just went immediately to his gun.

            Again, this is what we were told NOT to do in CHL, and this is what I have seen portrayed on shows by renowned experts who know the laws and peoples’ experiences. Leave the gun in the holster, figure out what is going on or call the cops or rally others or whatever … do NOT pull the gun unless there is a lethal threat. There NEVER was a lethal threat here … most folks are arguing that you pull the gun in case you see one, or in case one develops, or whatever … well hell, that means you have your gun in hand just about every minute of the day cuz something MIGHT happen. Once again, the FACTS of this situation prove me right, there NEVER was a lethal threat, ever … and in fact this “family” … OY! … all bailed out before the po-pos even showed up.

          • War Hammer

            It doesn’t matter if it was a family fight. The law doesn’t care if you’re family when you’re assaulting someone else. No one knew these people were family at the time. The statement that this is a family thing could have been a lie. The old man was assaulted and blood was drawn according to the story. I would have waited a bit longer to see if the group would have left but every indication here is that they were willing to confront an an armed person. My skill set affords me more time. However, once I am inside the 5 step range with a CW, my other skills have to be laid aside because of the presence of a weapon. Some of the best trained LEOs have been killed with their own weapon because they believed that their other skill sets would accomplish the mission. I bet they feel differently in the afterlife. The only time that I haven’t laid my other skills aside is when there were at least two other armed people present.

          • ben

            Dude Warhammer i understand your guff but this is written law you are fighting against something that is written sure there are exceptions but in this case the exception was it was a family alls the family has to do now is say it was a scuffle and sue that is it just give up and talk to any CHL instructor they guy did the wrong thing

          • War Hammer

            I’ll admit, I don’t know what the laws are where this crime was reportedly committed. But, I sure can get people riled up and make them think, talk. I’m not trying to fight. I would need emotions to want to fight. I’m just bored. I have a personal code of conduct that is probably different than everyone elses but this is just a blog or a forum, an exchange of ideas. No one should take these forums seriously. I don’t even know if this article that we’re talking about is even real. I wasn’t there to see it. I have no feelings one way or the other about anything. I’m wasn’t “built” with them.

          • ronigee dawg

            Yes and No, you definitely have a point about getting INTO a situation BRINGING the weapon in (still concealed) … but you can also make the argument it IS concealed and therefore really only comes into play IF you or the perp brings it into play. I been in these situations and dealt with them directly (I’m the type of kook that will jump in with both feet, hell I even took out my OWN guy in a hockey fight) … frankly now that I am CHL I am a little concerned how it changes things.

            And you are right … in an assault, rules change. nothing to do with this. CHL is on the other side of the parking lot … LOOK AT THE PICTURE … no clue what is going on or exactly who is involved … he IMMEDIATELY GOES TO HIS GUN. Who’s blood? How? Did fall-down drunk uncle bump his head and kids were trying to get his keys to keep him from driving? Gunslinger had no clue, he was already pointing gun. Nobody knows what started all this, cuz gunslinger was the ONLY guy on the scene when the cops showed up … Uncle got the f* out when he heard the sirens.

            Now, does THAT change things a bit? ;-)

            Read what I am saying, I NEVER said don’t get involved, I NEVER said do not stop a direct aggressive threat, I NEVER said most of the empty headed manure the armchair cowboys herein are ascribing to me … I said the CHL was DEAD WRONG in his response because he had no clue what the hell was going on … in fact he took the COWARD’S way out … whip out the gun and threaten to kill people.

          • edslides

            wrong, asshole. in texas, if cops are called to a domestic disturbance, and PARTICULARLY, if there is blood, the law demands that someone goes to jail. take you book learnin and shove it up your ass sideways. im talking from experience. i went to jail, but no charges were filed.

          • ronigee dawg

            A*hole? so did you at least stop beating your wife? (sorry, that was TOO easy). You come on a forum telling folks you were thrown in jail for beating somebody and you throw down words like A*hole? REALLY? LOL

            where was the domestic disturbance here? are you sure? see, ONE guy told the story … man who pulled his gun from across the parking lot. the trailer park trash got the f out of there when they heard the sirens, including Uncle. So exactly how did Uncle bloody his nose? Was uncle sober? See, you don’t know manure. Guess what, neither did Clint Jr when he drew down on these people. Oh, btw … Uncle was surrounded by people AND Uncle had a bloody nose … all from across the parking lot … WHEN THE GUY PULLED HIS GUN.

            You don’t have a clue … neither did Gene. You gettin’ the picture, A*?

        • I think you find, state by state it varies. So if one of these “Unarmed” people came walking towards you, you would shoot this unarmed person?. I am pretty sure in Texas, you would be on death row for something like that.
          This is NOT personal defence, simple as that, if Texas believe civilians can police the streets, then you have something wrong with your State, or you are very wrong.

          • War Hammer

            There are too many variables left unexplained. Take me for example. The law considers me to be a lethal threat whether I am armed or not. If you could surmise that I intended harm toward you but I’m not showing a gun, you should shoot me if you can. I have had the great fortune of not causing people to want to shoot me so far based on this. Though, I have been shot a few times a stabbed a few more.

      • thomas

        Wrong, in Texas you can protect others that are in immediate danger as well as protect their property if they ask you to. You are justified under the law as to what level you deem necessary to protect yourself and others. You can make a citizens arrest just the same under the same provisions. 7 on 1 on an elderly is proof to use deadly force, and banishing a gun just makes sure that the 7 did not turn on you from the get go. And to your point that you’ll just act physically without pulling a gun, go ahead and do that, see if they take the gun from you and turn the tides.

        • ronigee dawg

          which is why in the TX CHL training they specifically tell you NOT to do this. RIGHT??? Who told you it was 7 on 1? Have you ever seen 3 on 1, did the guy walk away? In this case, 7 on 1 and Uncle not only walked away, but got the hell out before LEOs showed up … GOT IT??? With a active gun call at a grocery store, how long would it be before cops came roaring in? Are you beginning to get the picture here?? Clint wannabe drew from WAY too far away, had NO CLUE what was really going on, and ultimately it turned out to be a family squabble … if you do the math, there is almost NO CHANCE what was really going on was what Clint Jr said it was.

      • edslides

        what part of texas do you live in? and the gun was to PREVENT the situation from escalating. if he had waited til they came after him to beat him, and he shot them, you would blame the guy for not doing something. move back to cali, please?

        • ronigee dawg

          CHL training at Frisco (Texas) gun club … feel free to go tell the owner he does not know what he is talking about.

          Also, numerous shows on personal security and concealed carry on the sportsmen channel(s) … I don’t remember exactly which ones but they repeat them all the time (6xx channels on DirecTV, you can figure out what they are on your own) … nationally renowned experts in the subject (what are YOUR credentials?) … overall message : CHL does NOT make you LEOs.

          The gun didn’t PREVENT anything … it was an aggressive use of force. CHL ASSERTED himself into a situation. Prevent would be if he was being attacked and stopped it … he USED THE GUN TO ASSERT AUTHORITY OVER THE SITUATION. Case closed. What you are saying essentially is that ANY situation, particularly situations with 3rd parties that have no clue what is going on, should be escalated to life and death to resolve? Pretty sick. And btw … if there are a lot of these, guess what is going to happen?

          Re: IF there had been a lethal response to a DIRECT THREAT … you are an A*hole … never happened. just because you are an idiot does not mean people that disagree with you (and can back it up with experts) are wrong. Grow up.

        • MiMg

          you gun nuts need to start following the LAW.

  • GunTotingFoolio

    HE should NOT have pulled his gun, rather CALL THE POLICE, and witness what’s taking place. If the guy’s life is in danger, then stop the threat! TOTALLY WRONG way to deal with this. Never pull a gun and command others. You are not the police and you are not required to protect the public. That gun was for HIS SAFETY…

    • NotaPoster

      I missed the part where police are required to protect the public. Look it up. They’re not.

    • War Hammer

      I agree, never pull a gun to command others. I disagree with not protecting others.

      • GunTotingFoolio

        Hammer, what happens when you get involved and don’t know ALL of the facts? Remember the obvious is not always obvious… You see an attacker stabbing a man and shoot him, only to find out that the victim was stabbing the suspect, and you just killed him…. You only know the facts, when protecting yourself and people in your immediate group/family… No mistakes there…

        • War Hammer

          I don’t play what if. Should that happen, I will be Sure to let you know.

          • GunTotingFoolio

            The only time commanding someone would be justified would be if a guys going to Babe Ruth a chick and you draw and tell him to drop the weapon… This happened to me and I saved her life and his, only for them to be together the next day like nothing happened… I should have let him take her head off, and then eliminated the threat!

  • Mike Gilmer

    The Bloomberg group would not mind someone being beaten to death in this situation. They do not care if a few lives are lost so long as their agenda is moving forward.

    • DJBryanW

      With all due respect, couldn’t liberals make the same argument for supporters of the 2nd Amendment? For example, the NRA doesn’t care if children are killed in school shootings as long as their agenda is moving forward? It sounds stupid, doesn’t it? So does your comment. While I support gun ownership 100% suggesting that people who believe in restricting gun ownership would be comfortable with others dying does nothing to move the conversation forward. It actually hurts the conversation.

      • Brock Johnson

        While I see the point you are trying to make it is not the same thing. The NRA believes in arming teachers and having armed guards at schools to stop the situation while the bloomberg group offers nothing to stop the crime so it would indeed seem they would rather some people get beaten to death than a criminal get shot.

        • ronigee dawg

          Oh, no … they would be HAPPY to impose a police state … where everything you do or say is monitored … BODY CAMS FOR EVERYBODY!!!

        • MiMg

          you’re wrong, as are all gun lovers

          • Brock Johnson

            Great argument. Oh you’re wrong well maybe I just believe you’re wrong. Legal gun owners are rarely involved in a commitment of a crime. This is been proven time and time again. So just keep drinking the Kool Aid and voting for the liberal trash that is the Democratic Party.

      • Mike Gilmer

        Sandy Hook was a terrible tragedy used by the Bloombergs of the world to further their agenda of gun control even though that tragedy had nothing to do with gun control. It was the liberal mayor of Chicago that said “Never let a tragedy go to waste.”

        • Stephan Williams

          funny you should mention, Sandy Hook… Sandy Hook was a false flag operation. No one was killed and the supposed “parents” were all crisis actors. If you don’t know these facts by now, you need to find some alternative media sources.

          • Mike Gilmer

            I seriously hope you are making a misguided attempt at either sarcasm or humor. If not, you are seriously disturbed.

          • MiMg

            so are gun owners

          • Mike Gilmer

            And another leftist makes a totally irrelevant comment.

      • Fedup Veteran

        The NRA in no way condones or supports children being killed in schools and you know that so your argument is stupid. And if you do a little research, you will find that the vast majority of school shootings or any other mass shootings, are carried by those who vote blue or come from a blue family. Fact is, shootings in schools or mass shootings anywhere, are deplorable and I don’t know anyone who would condone or support monsters who carry out those shootings whether they be gun grabbers or gun toters! The fact of the matter is that we live in a time where there is no concern for the life of others as long as the “me” generation is happy. Therein lies the problem, the “me” generation we live in. As long as I am okay, I don’t care about you where Christ says to love your neighbor as yourself. Just the simple Golden Rule is what it is all about and because God has been removed from our society, society no longer cares about anyone but itself.

        • MiMg

          not true, they are AGAINST Universal Background Checks

          • kyew

            The NRA is the group that pushed to have background checks implemented, you braying dolt.

  • Jerome

    I give him 5 stars.

  • Leon Harrison

    It is good that he did not shoot, as that would have led to his arrest, prosecution, prison and a double-jeopardy civil suit. He used restraint and good sense, as was taught during our Ohio 12 hour CCW classes, until it was recently reduced to only eight by these wannabe Second Amendment hero dumbasses.

    • War Hammer

      Every CHL carrier should know to expect all of this except the part concerning prison if they follow what they were taught in their CHL course. In Texas, I had to take a 16 hour course.

      • MiMg

        it should be 60 hours!

    • MiMg

      12 isn’t enough, I think if we have to go through WEEKS if not MONTHS of classes to be allowed to DRIVE, we should have to go ATLEAST as much to get a weapon that KILLS

  • ronigee dawg

    I would suggest you take this down … this is EXACTLY the example of what NOT to do with CHL … you do NOT get into the middle of a fight, particularly when there are no weapons involved … and bring out deadly force. This guy should have called 9-11 immediately, he could have gotten involved to stop what he perceived was the attack, including rallying others to assist … but to pull that gun was TOTALLY inappropriate until there was a direct threat on him.

    CHL does NOT make you a police officer … hell a PO in this situation, drawing his firearm, would likely be in for a heap of trouble. If one of the people in the crowd sees that this guy is approaching with a gun … THEY would have been justified in bringing out theirs because somebody ELSE is threatening aggression with a weapon.

    • Wibbins

      You’re just plan stupid. No weapons doesn’t mean there’s no deadly force, how many people are killed with punches or head banged into asphalt

      • ronigee dawg

        Yes, cuz you are such the expert. Actually, there are physical altercations daily where there is barely injury, let alone death. The “one punch kills” anecdote is about a 1 in a million situation, generally involving trauma from an inadvertent source (i.e. hits the curb or something else) … you watch too much TV, genius.

        Regardless … as long as we are talking about stupid … with your brilliant insights can you name a situation where you CANNOT have deadly force, professor? so what you are saying is that if two people are in any argument, oh even a heated one like Hawgs vs Alabama … this moron can yank out his gun and start aiming it at the people? Exactly who is stupid?

        Oh … btw … if you are going to be calling folks stupid, you might want to double check your spelling … just “plain” sayin. LMAO

        • Says He, with the spelling of “sayin”.

        • Robert Travis Howard

          You obvious have confused the concept of physical assault with verbal assault. Your accusation of stupidity is invalid, because you are stupid yourself.

          • MiMg

            ronigee dawg is COMPLETELY RIGHT

          • kyew

            Considering the source (you, to be specific), I think he might even contest your endorsement of his idiocy with your own.

        • MiMg

          well said, and THIS is why I’m COMPLETELY anti gun. JUST because someone CANT control their anger or argument does NOT give them the right to pull their weapon or use it against someone who is NOT using deadly force against them, well said!

          • ronigee dawg

            This is why you are a fool. JUST because the VAST MAJORITY of people (and I am talking 99%, not like what flaming liberal idiots consider a “HUGE” majority like 45%) … that carried concealed are *extremely* cautious about it and NEVER actually have any ‘encounters’ at all in their lives.

            BTW … you are NOT anti-gun (it is nothing more than a piece of metal … like being anit-rock or anti-bat), you are anti-Constitution, anti- fundamental rights; and frankly a quivering mass of goo that is not worthy of the benefits granted to you by the Founders of this Nation. NOBODY says that YOU have to carry, but you sticking your nose into other peoples’ business, particularly empowering corrupt and tyrannical scumbags (all of whom are VERY careful to make sure that THEY never lose THEIR ability to arm themselves AND to arm others against us) to *illegally* and immorally harm your neighbors, is quite detestable.

  • Phillip Coffey

    So, it took 6 relatives to back up the nephew against the uncle? Something wasn’t right and I would have probably done as Gene did. He arrested the fight and no one was hurt any more than they already were. “Nuff said”

    • fred

      If a group of people are attacking me in a parking lot, I hope Phillip Coffey is there. Not ronigee dawg.

    • MiMg

      immediately someone should’ve called the police, someone else should’ve immediately called out for assistance, someone else shoul’dve gone into the closest store for any security guard help they had

  • Theodore Sloat

    Some people should not have a gun, if YOU can’t operate a KEYBOARD without premature CAPSLOCK you should do the rest of us a favor and never use something MORE complicated than a can opener. As for the dude with the gun, bravo! Right or wrong at least he did something!

    • MiMg

      wrong

  • Sean McCloy

    The law needs to press charges against somebody to keep these fools from taking this crap in the streets.

  • Mark W. Mullins

    In a society where crime is on the increase, and the police force is limited due to budget cuts, anything that keep crime to a level of zero must be done. This gentleman did a very brave thing, and I honor him for his actions. Even families turn on each other in this day and time, and a good Samaritan is always needed. Good going Gene !!

    • MiMg

      guess to cuts budgets? REPUBLICANS

  • Promontorium

    I probably wouldn’t have pointed the gun at anyone unless they refused to cease their attack (having the basic gun safety rules embedded in me) but I do not besmirch his actions which were moral, resolute, and ultimately measured.

    • MiMg

      exactly, I would warn them that I have a gun, if they didn’t stop, I would show the gun, if they continued I’d shoot a warning round in the air, if they still continued I’d tell them that I’m going to shoot them unless they stop immediately

      • kyew

        A warning round in the air… you really are a moron. What goes up must come down, and you’re accountable for every round you fire.

        Still want to fire a random bullet into the air, genius?

  • Concealed carry does not mean we can police the streets, it is for self defense only. The only involvement he should of had, was calling the cops.

    I conceal carry, but would never pull my weapon unless it directly affected me. Can’t people just step in without pulling a gun for petes sake?, have we become a nation of pussies?

    • Robert Travis Howard

      Okay, you just sit there and watch while someone gets beaten and maybe killed. Call the cops, because it only takes them several minutes to arrive, while you stand there with the power to possibly save a life at that very moment. Sounds to me like you’re the pussy.

      • MiMg

        nope, you are

        • kyew

          Says the brainiac who’s voting up his own posts. You’re a paragon of intelligence, dunce.

  • Josh Gilman

    Ahhh – Americans at their finest.

    • Robert Travis Howard

      Damn straight.

      • MiMg

        wrong

    • MiMg

      nope

      • Josh Gilman

        The guy who was going to help a person in need, yes – very good thing to do. The trashy family beating each other, not so much. If you’re disagreeing with the first point, I’m sure people will make a point to not help you when you need it.

  • J. Wade Harrell

    I think it is a bad idea to pull a gun in a fist fight that you are not part of, especially if you didn’t see how it started. The right to bear arms doesn’t make us all peace officers.

  • NebrDan

    So take that you mom’s demand action, Thank you Gene for stepping up. I bet cnn, msnbc and the rest of the liberal news station will not report this! And some where a bed wetting liberal is cowring in a corner!

    • MiMg

      no such thing as liberal news, maybe maddow on msnbc, that’s it

  • aebe

    Guess who stops more crimes than do the police………..Armed American Citizens

    Validate your 2nd Amendment Rights . Carry

    • MiMg

      nope, you gun owners are a threat to yourselves and everyone around you

  • Tom Murphy

    This a case of elder abuse. Certainly a crime.

  • James Dunn

    Moms Demand Action is just another lunatic group financed by Bloomberg, Mr. Anti-big gulp himself!

    • MiMg

      guns are terrible

  • wing_ding

    White trash on the loose …

  • Arturo

    This CCW was trying to get himself shot. He did absolutely the wrong thing. Yell to the people to stop and that you’re calling the police.